If I have say an Archetype of Imagination:

Creatures you control have flying.

Creatures your opponents control lose flying and can't have or gain flying.

and a Warden of Evos Isle:

Creature spells with flying you cast cost 1 less to cast.

Will a card that does not normally have flying receive the cost reduction or do they not gain flying until they reach the battlefield?

  • Short answer: "Creatures" means "creature permanents". "Creature permanents" and "creature spells" are mutually exclusive, so the abilities affect different objects. No cost reduction.
    – ikegami
    Mar 14, 2014 at 18:01

1 Answer 1


No, Archetype of Imagination does not interact with Warden of Evos Isle.

When Archetype, or any other card, refers to "creatures", it means creature permanents. So it does not affect creature cards or creature spells while they are in any other zone besides the battlefield. The relevant rule here is 109.2:

If a spell or ability uses a description of an object that includes a card type or subtype, but doesn't include the word "card," "spell," "source," or "scheme," it means a permanent of that card type or subtype on the battlefield.

  • Do you "control" cards not on the battlefield? In Yu-Gi-Oh, that would be another criterion to show why it doesn't work. Not sure about the definition of control in MTG.
    – scenia
    Mar 18, 2014 at 13:59
  • Yes, you control spells you have cast, but they are not permanents
    – murgatroid99
    Mar 18, 2014 at 14:07
  • What about in your hand? Do you start "controlling" them once they hit the stack or as soon as you get them in the first place?
    – scenia
    Mar 18, 2014 at 14:08
  • No, you don't control cards in your hand (control only makes sense in zones where multiple players can have cards at the same time), but that doesn't matter here because when you cast a spell it goes on the stack before you determine the cost.
    – murgatroid99
    Mar 18, 2014 at 14:11

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