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I have a Blue Black Mill deck with Sphinx's Tutelage and Day's Undoing (Whispering Madness works in the same way). If I had all four Tutelages on the field, and cast Days Undoing / Whispering Madness, how would the card draws work afterwards?

I am under the impression that either way this would give me the game, but would the opponent draw first, then me so that I could start milling them or do I draw first, start milling them, then they draw seven?

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For Day's Undoing they will not mill any cards, they will only draw 7. From the Magic Origins Update Bulletin:

713.1

This new rule explains a bit more about Day's Undoing and ending the turn. Day's Undoing is the first card that has additional effects before it ends the turn. If any abilities trigger while players are shuffling or drawing cards, before the "end the turn" procedure starts, those abilities won't be put onto the stack. The "end the turn" procedure will essentially eat them. Of course, abilities that trigger during the "end the turn" procedure will go on the stack during that turn's cleanup step. (These abilities are pretty rare though.)

For Whispering Madness you would both draw the appropriate number of cards, then for each card you drew you would have 4 Tutelage triggers go on the stack. They would draw before milling because triggered abilities wait to be put on the stack until a player would receive priority which doesn't happen until after the spell is done resolving.

603.3. Once an ability has triggered, its controller puts it on the stack as an object that’s not a card the next time a player would receive priority.

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Here is what happens when the active player casts Day's Undoing:

  1. The active player shuffles his or her hand and graveyard into his or her library and then draws seven cards.
  2. Sphinx's Tutelage triggers seven times, but those triggers do not go on the stack just yet.
  3. The nonactive player shuffles his or her library hand and graveyard into his or her library and then draws seven cards.
  4. The turn ends.

"The turn ends" means something special in Magic. Specifically, rule 713.1a says that any triggered abilities that are waiting to be put on the stack cease to exist.

713.1. Three cards (Time Stop, Sundial of the Infinite, and Day’s Undoing) end the turn. When an effect ends the turn, follow these steps in order, as they differ from the normal process for resolving spells and abilities (see rule 608, “Resolving Spells and Abilities”).

713.1a If there are any triggered abilities that triggered before this process began but haven’t been put onto the stack yet, those abilities cease to exist. They won’t be put onto the stack. This rule does not apply to abilities that trigger during this process (see rule 713.2).

And here is the rule that says explains why the active player draws first.

120.2a If an effect instructs more than one player to draw cards, the active player performs all of his or her draws first, then each other player in turn order does the same.

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  • Ah... that's my decks win mechanic shot to pieces... I was under the impression that four Tutelages and Days undoing would Mill them for 56 cards minimum... I guess I miss understood the End turn bit. My thought was that you drew cards before you end the turn? – ThunderToes Jan 21 '16 at 14:30
  • @NathanTaylor You do draw the cards. I'll expand the answer a bit. – Rainbolt Jan 21 '16 at 14:37
  • I just read the article... guess im just disappointed I couldn't use that as a nifty win mechanic. Cheers guys!! – ThunderToes Jan 21 '16 at 14:44
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You both draw 7 at the same time. At that point, the triggers from Sphinx's Tutelage are pending going on the stack. Then the turn ends. At that point, those pending triggers are removed from the stack and the turn ends.

So, you have 7 cards, no graveyard, and your opponent has 7 cards, no graveyard. (You still have your Tutelages, so good luck!)

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  • @Rainbolt Doesn't 713.2 mean that the triggers go on the stack since during the course of the card resolving the triggers are, well, triggered? Or is it the fact that the end the turn is a different sentence make a difference? – JonTheMon Jan 21 '16 at 14:16
  • No, Tutelage's trigger wait to go on stack when Day’s Undoing resolves, but as per rule 713.1a they don't. If something would trigger during turn end process (not before it), e.g. due to moving to cleanup step, rule 713.2 would apply. – Vilmar Jan 21 '16 at 14:24
  • Also, the active player draws the cards first, then other players in turn order. – Vilmar Jan 21 '16 at 14:30

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