I have a 3/2 with six +1/+1 counters on it, making it a 9/8. My friend used Prey Upon targeting it with his own 5/5. He said the +1/+1 counters didn't count while fighting, and that it was just considered a 3/2. Is that true?

  • @ikegami Check your math. Feb 28, 2017 at 3:02
  • It's a 9/8, period. It's not "considered" anything else.
    – ikegami
    Feb 28, 2017 at 3:04

2 Answers 2


No, your friend is wrong. The creatures simply deal damage equal to their power:

701.11a A spell or ability may instruct a creature to fight another creature or it may instruct two creatures to fight each other. Each of those creatures deals damage equal to its power to the other creature.

A 9/8 has a power of 9, and it doesn't matter what its base power was. The whole point of power/toughness-changing effects (like +1/+1 counters) is that they change the power/toughness of the creature.

So your friend's 5/5 will die, and your 9/8 will survive.

Terminology: we say your creature has base power/toughness of 3/2, but its power/toughness is 9/8. Pretty much nothing in the game cares what base power/toughness is; the only time it's mentioned is when it's being set, like on Turn to Frog. Everything normal in the game just looks at the actual power/toughness.

  • 2
    It might be helpful to point out that the 3/2 is the 'base power and toughness' and things only care about that when they specifically say so (the only times I can think of is when it is getting set)
    – diego
    Feb 26, 2017 at 1:51

Your friend may have been confused because certain abilities that modify or care about combat damage do not apply to two creatures "fighting" because it is not considered combat damage as defined by the rules. For example, first strike and double strike don't "count" when creatures fight because those abilities modify the combat step. They deal damage at a different time during the combat step. If they fight via Prey Upon, they do not go through all the Combat steps, and there isn't a separate first strike combat damage step for those abilities to apply.

  • This is more of an assumption than an answer to the OP. It would be nice if the downvoters could give you constructive criticism on how this answer does not fit the question. From what I can read you mention the combat phase but the OP doesn't. This does not provide a definitive answer. Just thought I'd give you a heads up on why I think you have been downvoted here. Mar 1, 2017 at 9:22

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