I have the following scenario in a 7 wonders game played with leaders and cities that can be interpreted in at least 2 ways.

Alice has in play the leader "Berenice" (From the moment she enters play, each amount of coins taken from the bank is increased by 1. This increase is limited to one coin per turn).

In Age A, turn T, Alice plays a card that would allow her to take 3 coins (not counting Berenice's effect) from the bank.
In the same age, same turn, Bob plays a black (cities) card that makes every other player discard 3 coins.

Let's assume that Alice does not want to take debt tokens instead of discarding the coins.
This makes the total coin delta for this turn for Alice be 0 (zero).

Does Alice get 1 coin from the bank because of Berenice or not?

Same question but rephrased.
Taking coins from the bank and discarding coins are 2 separate actions in the same turn, or there is only one action "take / discard" depending on the sum of the coins to be taken minus the sum of coins to be discarded?

2 Answers 2


The Cities rules say about "Debts" (on page 4):

Important: monetary losses are always resolved at the end of a turn, after players have played their cards, possibly having paid for trade and/or obtained money...

So Alice takes 4 coins (3 + 1), and then she decides whether she wants to

  • pay 3 coins,
  • pay 2 coins and take 1 Debt token,
  • pay 1 coin and take 2 Debt tokens, or
  • take 3 Debt tokens.

I do believe each action should be separated and she should get her bonus coin.

It says she increases any amount taken from the bank by one. With examples from the rulebook "Discarding a card gives 4, tavern 6...."

So any building gain is automatically increased. If the building says "Take 3" you automatically read that as 4 when you have Berenice. The delta doesn't matter.

  • Thanks. So, for the question "Does Alice get 1 coin from the bank because of Berenice or not?" the answer is "Yes, Alice gets 1 coin from the bank."
    – Marius
    Commented Aug 3, 2018 at 7:34
  • @Marius I do believe so. Even if the building gave only 1 gold I believe Alice would get 2 and then have to pay 3 (or take debt tokens)
    – Ontamu
    Commented Aug 3, 2018 at 7:38
  • 1
    sorry for changing the tick to the other answer, but it has reference to the rule book.
    – Marius
    Commented Aug 3, 2018 at 15:49
  • @Marius no need to apologize, it is the better answer. I voted it up :)
    – Ontamu
    Commented Aug 4, 2018 at 14:04

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