8

Faceless Haven has "all creature types" after paying ❄️❄️❄️. So it is also a "Wall". Walls can't attack. So, why can Faceless Haven and all Shapshifters from Kaldheim attack at all?

2
  • Shapeshifter is a creature type like every other. The "changeling"-keyword gives a creature all creature types. A shapeshifter w/o abilities wouldn't be a wall. Just tiny nitpicking =)
    – Erik
    Jan 6 at 11:28
  • @Erik they said "shapeshifters from Kaldheim", all of which have changeling. And because of the way layers work, even if you removed the changeling ability they would still have all creature types. Jan 8 at 9:06
29

Walls not being able to attack was an old, original rule. In Champions of Kamigawa, the Wall type was decoupled from gameplay into the "Defender" keyword. Wizard's rule change

All old walls were errata'd to have Defender, and all new "natural" walls are printed with Defender.

13

Walls can attack. Creatures with Defender, on the other hand, cannot.

The walls you're thinking off (e.g. Wall of Shadows) have Defender (see the oracle text), which is why they can't attack. Faceless Haven doesn't have this ability, hence it can attack even though it's a wall.

7
  • 3
    It probably is worth mentioning that walls used to be unable to attack in the old days. Do you know when the rules changed?
    – Swimmer F
    Jan 4 at 10:03
  • 3
    @SwimmerF Kamigawa block in 2004 (at the same time as the Legend -> legendary change, interestingly).
    – Cadence
    Jan 4 at 10:28
  • @Allure, Ageless Sentinels does not have "defender" Jan 4 at 11:58
  • 1
    @DenisGladkiy it does, check the oracle text: gatherer.wizards.com/pages/card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=43713
    – Allure
    Jan 4 at 11:59
  • 6
    @DenisGladkiy What's printed on a card doesn't matter, the oracle text is what matters since that gets updated when rules change and cards get errata. Ageless Sentinels does have Defender, it was added to the oracle text for all walls that existed before the rules change.
    – Andrew
    Jan 4 at 15:39
9

This was an old rule that the wall creature type couldn't attack. It was changed in the major CR update in 2004. Walls can now attack and a new keyword ability, defender, was created and added to existing walls as errata. This opened up the ability to create the changeling keyword a few years later in the Lorwyn/Shadowmoor block. (Faceless Haven honestly should have had changeling rather than the more complicated granting text)

Now they even include a special entry in the Glossary of the Comprehensive rules to cover this change:

Wall: A creature type with no particular rules meaning. Older cards with the Wall creature type but without defender had an unwritten ability that precluded them from attacking. Those cards have received errata in the Oracle card reference to have defender. Some older cards that referenced the Wall creature type have also received errata. See Defender.

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    I think this answer is mostly the same as JonTheMon's. By I will mark as "accepted" theirs because it was earlier. Thanks for the help anyway. Jan 4 at 16:18
  • @DenisGladkiy yeah they're similar, I wanted to reference the CR glossary and link in defender in addition to just talking about the kamigawa era rules updates
    – Andrew
    Jan 4 at 16:34
  • RE: using "changeling" rather than ability text: according to the fan wiki, adding a (keyword) ability such as changeling would happen after changing types, so using "with changeling" wouldn't actually give the Faceless Haven all types (the only type-changing affect in the ability text would be "becomes a creature"). (In the rules, section 613 states adding types is layer 4, and adding abilities is layer 6.) Note other cards use "gains all creature types" rather than "gains changeling".
    – outis
    Jan 7 at 18:26
  • @outis that's true, though I said I think it should have changeling, not gain changeling. I can see the concern both ways, with having a non-creature with creature types (not that it hasn't happened before) though it might have needed the Tribal type too then (as much as MaRo hates the type).
    – Andrew
    Jan 7 at 22:35

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