On a recent edh game a player was returning all the dragons from his graveyard to play. One of those dragons was Terror of the Peaks, so other dragons would trigger him. All of them enter at the same time, but the active player chooses to have Terror of the Peaks enter first. Is it possible to instant kill Terror of the Peaks and avoid the damage? Some other players were arguing, that the damage is already on the stack, and it does not matter if the dragon is killed. I do not think so.
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2 Answers
but the active player chooses to have Terror of the Peaks enter first
That's not possible, if an effect returns all dragons from a graveyard to the battlefield, they all enter at the same time. But Terror of the Peaks' ability still triggers for each other dragon; see for example Cards entering the battlefield simultaneously and "Enter the Battlefield" effects.
Is it possible to instant kill Terror of the Peaks and avoid the damage?
No. It does not matter that the source of the damage is no longer around by the time it resolves. Mogg Fanatic would be a rather stupid card if that was the case. See Does an ability resolve if the source of the ability leaves the battlefield? for more information.
answered Oct 10, 2021 at 14:17
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3If you manage to give yourself protection from red at instant speed, that might work. But you cannot do anything while the resurrection effect resolves and Terror of the Peaks' ability triggers and is put on the stack.– Glorfindel ♦Commented Oct 10, 2021 at 14:26
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5If you have an instant-speed way to exile a card from a graveyard, you could pick off Terror of the Peaks before the resurrection effect resolves, so it never comes back to life in the first place. There are also a handful of effects that specifically counter triggered abilities.– CadenceCommented Oct 10, 2021 at 16:37
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4That, or simply counter the resurrection spell / ability. (That way, you don't have to deal with the other pesky dragons...) The question was about killing the Terror of the Peaks and that is out of the equation.– Glorfindel ♦Commented Oct 10, 2021 at 17:13
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3@Euphorbium An instant speed way to reduce the power of the other creatures would also work, because that is only checked as the ability resolves. Commented Oct 11, 2021 at 3:40
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1If the creatures were brought into play with a pile of individual effects (one per creature, instead of all in one effect), then I guess you could wait for Terror's effect to resolve, stack something to kill it, and have those effects kill Terror before the effects bringing any other creatures back would resolve, right?– ilkkachuCommented Oct 11, 2021 at 11:15
Removing Terror of the Peaks isn't going to do what you hope, but the good news is that there are instant-speed effects that could reduce or eliminate some of the damage. Let's start by looking at the exact wording of Terror's ability:
Whenever another creature enters the battlefield under your control, Terror of the Peaks deals damage equal to that creature's power to any target.
I've highlighted the phrase we're going to take advantage of here.
First, let's note what's not going to work:
- If all the dragons come into play at the same time (via Haunting Voyage or Patriarch's Bidding, for example), then no, all the triggers are going to go on the stack no matter what you do; you can't remove Terror "before" that happens.
- If, while the effects are on the stack, you kill Terror, that's not going to stop the effects from resolving.
- If, while the effects are on the stack, you destroy or exile another dragon, then the effect will still resolve, and it will use the "last known information" rule to still deal the damage
So, what will work? (Some of these are mentioned in comments)
- Countering the resurrection spell
- Exiling Terror from the graveyard while the resurrection spell is on the stack, so it never comes into play
- Reducing the power of one or more of the other dragons, via something like Flunk or Olivia's Midnight Ambush
In this last case, the damage is determined on resolution. Note that if your effect kills the dragon, then the "last known information" rule will see the negative power it had as it died, not the positive power it had originally.
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Would you be able to use something like Bane of the living, or Voidmage Apprentice to counter the spell of ameliorate the situation with the dragons power and toughness? If so, as morph doesn't use the stack what's the latest you could use them? My gut says it's later than an instant but I'm not sure. Commented Oct 16, 2021 at 8:56
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1@Pureferret The morph flip itself doesn't use the stack, but the "when (card name) is turned face up" trigger does go on the stack (when the flip occurs) and resolves as normal. So both those cards would work great, but aren't that much different than other instant-speed creature-shrinking or counter-spell effects.– BradCCommented Oct 18, 2021 at 2:14
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To add to that great list you could Tale's End one of the the effects, and you could end the turn with Discontinuity to fully stop the pain. But I guess you could just counter with Discontinuity– AndreyCommented Nov 3, 2021 at 19:35